Senate Energy and Natural Resources: Business meeting

Committee will come to order. Good morning to all. Today we have over 20 bills with accompanying amendments. I support all these bills and I urge colleagues to join me in supporting them. By way of a run-of-show, I'm going to give my opening statement, then recognize Ranking Member Senator Heinrich to give his opening statement, given the number of bills and amendments that we're going to be voting on.

And in order to accommodate other members' schedules, we've got multiple chairmen in this room with other committee assignments. We're going to try to coordinate those. So to that end, even if we're mid-opening statement, the minute we've got a reporting quorum, we will detour momentarily in order to cast votes. And then after both the voting And the statements have concluded.

I'll recognize any senator who may wish to speak on any piece of legislation noticed for today's hearing for as long as they want. We're almost there. Okay. We have several bills before us today, and I want to briefly highlight two of mine. The first is the Liberating Incandescent Technology Act.

This is one that we talked about in a hearing a week or two ago. The Biden administration used federal efficiency standards to effectively remove traditional incandescent light bulbs from store shelves. LED bulbs are a great option in many ways for millions of Americans. If consumers prefer them, where they prefer them, they should buy them. They have a lot of advantages.

They're efficient. They, uh, promise to last a long time. Um, but they're not necessarily right for everyone for every single use. Washington doesn't need to eliminate the alternative. The bill I mentioned, acronymed as the LIT Act, removed— removes incandescent bulbs from these federal efficiency requirements and leaves that choice where I think it belongs, where I think most Americans would like it to belong, with Americans themselves.

The second bill addresses off-highway vehicle access in Capitol Reef National Park in Utah. The legislation would extend Utah's motor vehicle rules for off-highway vehicles to certain roads within the park. It wouldn't just open up the park generally to OHV use, but those roads, roads that already allow cars. And this includes portions of the Burr Trail Road, Cathedral Road, Hartnett Road, Highway 24, the Notom Bullfrog Road, Pole Creek Road, Oil Ranch Road, and Baker Ranch Road. Branch Road.

Spent a lot of my youth and adulthood in and around these roads, and a number of them have deep personal meaning to me, including the Burr Trail Road, named after my wife's great-great-grandfather, John Atlantic Burr. He was one of two twins born to Mormon pioneers who took the odd trek— unlike most of my pioneer ancestors who traveled across the plains in covered wagons and hand carts to reach the Salt Lake Valley in the 1840s. My wife's family decided to take a boat. Leaving from New York, they sailed all the way down the Horn of South America and then up to the Sandwich Islands, now Hawaii. Then they used trade winds to go to San Francisco.

They were carrying a printing press that couldn't be hauled across the plains, so they then crossed the Sierra Nevada Mountains to get to Utah. It's a miracle any of them survived. In any event, John Atlantic Burr was named John Atlantic Burr because he was one of two twins born on that voyage, one on the Atlantic side, one on the Pacific side. And he has a lot of prosperity— prosperity today, including my wife and the 9 children born to their parents. Utahns and visitors from around the world love these lands, and this bill would make it easier for them to access and enjoy more of what Capitol Reef has to offer.

These are both strong bills, and I urge my colleagues to join me in advancing them through the committee today. Now I want to turn to an issue that this committee has spent years working on. For years, members on both sides of the aisle have recognized the same problem. America knows how to build. We have the workers, we have the resources, we have the technology.

What too often stands in the way is a permitting system that takes too long, that costs too much, and leaves too many projects waiting years or even decades for a final Answer: We once built projects, vast projects like the Hoover Dam, the Golden Gate Bridge, and the Empire State Building in years, not decades. The cost of these delays end up getting backed up and then baked into the cost of goods across the entire economy, from gasoline to electricity prices to grocery and home prices. Permitting delays have made it harder for American families to make ends meet. There's no reason the United States can't keep building great things and do so in a way that respects the environment, historical interests, and other things that are important to us. For many months, Ranking Member Heinrich and I have been working with Chairman Shelley Moore Capito and Ranking Member Sheldon Whitehouse on the Environment and Public Works Committee to find a bipartisan agreement that can make this process work better.

That work involved a lot of negotiation, compromise, and persistence by members and staff of both committees, and it involved input from members on both sides of the aisle. We've stood on the shoulders of giants, borrowing from other proposals that have been submitted over the years by many members of this committee and others. So after a lot of negotiations, Republicans and Democrats have reached an agreement on a bipartisan deal. But We got to be clear about where things stand. Uh, we negotiated in good faith, we made compromises, we accepted the deal.

We're at the goal line, and now it's time for Republicans and Democrats to move forward and for us to honor the agreement that we've made together and finish the job. This, of course, is the culmination of many years of work in Congress and many months of intense negotiations. The agreement addresses some of the most persistent sources of delay and uncertainty in the federal permitting process, which ultimately, when reformed, will make life more affordable for hardworking Americans. So I want to thank Ranking Member Heinrich and Chairman Capito and Ranking Member Whitehouse and their excellent teams, as well as all the other members who have provided helpful input along the way. That's what's gotten us this far.

Permitting reform has been discussed in Congress for a long time. Reaching agreement on the details is considerably harder. And it appears that we have a quorum present, and, uh, so let's, let's go ahead and start voting. Okay, first, the committee will be voting on 11 amendments by voice. Absent any objection, I ask that we proceed to a voice vote on the amendments en bloc.

These amendments are Amendment 12A to agenda item 12. Now, unless I indicate other— otherwise, each amendment that I reference, uh, will have a letter after it. The same number will correspond to the agenda item except where I indicate otherwise. So Amendment 12A to agenda item 12, Amendment 22A, Amendment 23A, 25A, 35A, 36A, 44A, 45A, 46A, 51A and 52A. Sounds like a session of "Ain't No Parkin'." Yes, well, I can't quite do that accent.

That's not what this is about. This is about boundaries. But the committee will now vote by voice and block on these amendments. All those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye.

Opposed, nay. The ayes appear to have it. The ayes do have it. The amendments are agreed to. Now we'll turn to a roll call vote on an amendment, Amendment 3A to Agenda Item 3, at the request of Senator Heinrich.

Absent any objection, I'll proceed to a roll call vote. You want to speak first? Just briefly, Mr. Chairman, I would like to offer my amendment to S.465. S.465, the Grid Power Act, would allow transmission providers to submit proposals to FERC, that would allow fossil fuel generators to jump those queue lines. Generator interconnection queues have faced backlogs for years, and to FERC's credit, the Commission has taken action in recent years to speed up these queues quite a bit, including issuing Order No.

2023. While issues remain with generator interconnection backlogs, favoring one form of generation over others is not a smart cost-saving path forward. My amendment would simply remove the word dispatchable from S.465. It would still allow transmission providers to speed up their generator interconnection queues, but in a generation-neutral manner. There's no debate that there is room for improvement in our generator interconnection queues, and I think actually that our bipartisan permitting package, once released, will show how Chairman Lee and I agree on some common sense solutions to improve these queues.

But FERC has never been in the business of picking winners and losers, and they shouldn't start today. So I would ask for a roll call vote on that amendment. Mr. Mr. Chairman. Yes, Senator. So this is an amendment to a bill that I introduced along with Senator Young.

Also, it's co-sponsored by Senators Marshall McCormick and Bernie Bueno Moreno, and I want to thank them for co-sponsoring. Uh, essentially it's an effort to try to increase grid reliability. So I certainly understand, uh, and sympathize with the important point, uh, that the ranking member made. And I know in the permitting reform bill y'all are working on, you know, you're going to what he just said, making sure that everybody gets a fair shot. But we have a real issue with grid reliability.

And if we don't get more baseload dispatchable energy on there, we destabilize the grid. So ironically, the unintended consequence of continuing to put intermittent energy on ahead of dispatchable destabilizes the grid, and you're gonna get less renewable or intermittent on there if we don't start addressing this and addressing it now. And that's really what this grid reliability bill is all about. We, we understand, recognize And I'm a fan of all of the above energy sources, but we understand different people advocate for different types of energy, whether it's traditional fossil fuel, renewable, dispatchable, intermittent, all those kinds of— I get it. But if we don't start addressing grid reliability now, we're going to take a problem we already have and exacerbate it.

And that's why I would ask for a no vote on the amendment. Thank you. Roll call vote having been requested, the clerk will call the roll. Mr. Lee. No.

Mr. Barrasso. No. Mr. Risch. No. Mr. Daines.

No. Mr. Cotton.

No by proxy. No by proxy. No by proxy. Mr. McCormick. No.

Mr. Justice. No. Mr. Cassidy. No. Ms. Hyde-Smith.

Yes. Ms. Murkowski. Mr. Hoeven. No. Mr. Heinrich.

Aye. Mr. Wyden. Aye by proxy. Ms. Cantwell. Aye by proxy.

Ms. Hirono. Aye, by proxy. Mr. King. Aye. Ms. Cortez Masto.

Aye. Mr. Hickenlooper. Aye, by proxy. Mr. Padilla. Aye.

Mr. Gallego. Aye, by proxy. On this vote, the yeas are 9, the nays are 11.

The nays have it, and the amendment is not adopted. Now we'll turn to the roll call votes on 3 bills. First is agenda item 3, S.465, sponsored by Senator Hoeven. The clerk will Call the roll. Mr. Lee.

Aye. Mr. Barrasso. Mr. Risch. Aye. Mr. Daines.

Mr. Cotton. Aye by proxy. Mr. McCormick. Mr. Justice. Mr. Cassidy.

Ms. Hyde-Smith. Ms. Murkowski. Mr. Hoeven. Mr. Heinrich. No.

Mr. Wyden. No by proxy. Ms. Cantwell. No by proxy. Ms. Hirono.

No by proxy. Mr. King. No. Ms. Cortez Masto. No.

Mr. Hickenlooper. No by proxy. Mr. Padilla. No. Mr. Gallego.

No by proxy. Would Senator Cantwell wish to be recorded as if in person rather than by proxy? Thank you. No. Thank you.

On this vote, the yeas are 11, the nays are 9.

The measure passes. Be advanced to the floor. Second is agenda item number 17, S1568, which I have sponsored. The clerk will call the roll. Mr. Lee.

Aye. Mr. Barrasso. Mr. Risch. Aye. Mr. Daines.

Mr. Cotton. Aye by proxy. Mr. McCormick. Aye. Mr. Justice.

Aye. Mr. Cassidy. Aye. Ms. Hyde-Smith. Aye.

Ms. Murkowski. Mr. Hovind. Mr. Heinrich. No. Mr. Wyden.

No by proxy. Ms. Cantwell. No. Ms. Hirono. No by proxy.

Mr. King. No. Ms. Cortez Masto. No. Mr. Hickenlooper.

No by proxy. Mr. Padilla. No. Mr. Gallego. No by proxy.

On this vote, the yeas are 11, the nays are 9. Yes, 1568 will be reported favorably to the Senate. Third is agenda item 22. S-2970, which I've sponsored. The clerk will call the roll.

Mr. Lee. Aye. Mr. Barrasso. Mr. Risch. Mr. Daines.

Mr. Cotton. Aye by proxy. Mr. McCormick. Mr. Justice. Mr. Cassidy.

Ms. Hyde-Smith. Ms. Murkowski. Mr. Hoeven. Mr. Heinrich. No.

Mr. Wyden. No by proxy. Ms. Cantwell. Ms. Hirono, no by proxy. Mr. King, no.

Ms. Cortez Masto, no. Mr. Hickenlooper, no by proxy. Mr. Padilla, no. Mr. Gallego, no by proxy. On this vote, the yeas are 11, the nays are 9.

Uh, the measure will be reported favorably to the Senate. Will now proceed to bills as amended, if amended, and, uh, voice, uh, votes on bills en bloc. These bills are agenda items 12, 23, 25, 35, 36, 38, 41, 43 through 48, 51, 52, and 54. Those are respectively S. 1254 and the House companion H.R. 331, S. 3371, S. 3524, and the House companion H.R.

7618, S. 4116, S. 4166, and the House companion H.R. 7257.

S.4252, S.4406, S.4846, S.4870, S.5352, S.5359, S.5360, S.5374, H.R.677, H.R.2306, and H.R.5729. The committee will vote on these 16 bills and block by voice as amended, if amended, for these 16 bills as a block. All those in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed say nay.

The ayes appear to have it. The ayes do have it. These 16 bills will be reported favorably to the Senate. Mr. Chairman? Yes, Senator Kamala.

May I be recorded as an aye on the Heinrich Amendment? You will be recorded as an aye on the Heinrich Amendment. Thank you. Thank you. Let's see, why don't we finish opening statements?

We'll turn now to Senator Heinrich for his opening statement. Thank you, members, for your cooperation in the votes. Thank you, Chairman, and I look forward to advancing a number of bills on this agenda, including important legislation that I have offered with Senator Risch to restore economic support for much-needed road and infrastructure improvements near the Department of Energy's Waste Isolation Pilot Plant. I'm also pleased that we will consider bipartisan legislation related to cybersecurity and the electric grid and advancing geothermal research. At a time of rising electric bills and increasing new demands on the grid, this committee should focus on lowering costs and increasing reliability.

That's why I've asked to have bipartisan weatherization legislation included on the agenda. For 50 years, the Popular Weatherization Program has helped add insulation, repair furnaces, and make other home efficiency upgrades to households who need it most. We have a chance to extend and improve a program that has served more than 7 million families, saving households an average of $372 per year and supporting 8,500 good jobs. Unfortunately, the Chairman has declined to bring weatherization bills up for a vote today. Instead, we are spending our time and attention liberating— quote-unquote, light bulbs that industry doesn't even make and most of us haven't seen or thought about in a decade.

According to analysis of DOE and EIA data by consumer groups, LED light bulbs save the average household $370 a year on their electric bills. Earlier this month, I submitted a letter of opposition for the record to S. 1568, the Liberating Incandescent Technology Act, or the LITT Act, from industry. The National Electrical Manufacturers Association and the American Lighting Association warned of Chinese products flooding the market if this bill becomes law. I would now ask for unanimous support— sorry, unanimous consent to submit a letter of opposition to S. 1568 from consumer groups. Without objection.

Consumer Reports, the Consumer Federation of America, and the National Consumer Law Center urge members to vote no on S. 1568. And protect Americans from skyrocketing energy costs. I'm also concerned about S.465, the Grid Power Act. The bill would codify queue jumping, allowing natural gas power plants to connect to the grid faster than clean energy sources. This is not necessary, as FERC approved a one-time process to allow some power plants to skip to the front of the line while remaining technologically neutral.

Changing this now, especially as this administration illegally props up uneconomic coal plants, could be harmful to families' and small businesses' bottom lines. So I have an amendment that would keep the requirement for FERC to modify its generator interconnection procedures, but would allow transmission providers to simply prioritize, quote, "new power projects that will improve grid reliability and resource adequacy." end quote. Any project, not just those favored by this administration, that improves our grid's reliability could be expedited under this language. Additionally, I'd like to voice my concern over S. 2970, the OHVs in Capitol Reef National Park Act, which would authorize the use of off-highway vehicles inside the park. All 12 roads defined in the bill are accessible to conventional vehicles, so the idea that this bill increases access to parkland is dubious.

If passed, the bill would strain local emergency medical services, wear down backcountry roads faster, and push noise levels past National Park Service standards. Lastly, on the North Rim and Kaibab National Forest Restoration Act, I have filed an amendment to ensure transparency and oversight of the non-competitive contracts authorized by the bill. We have seen what happens when this administration doesn't have to go through regular competitive contracting processes. We get shoddy work, like the reflecting pool, with taxpayer money funneled to the president's donors. The last thing the communities of Northern Arizona need is for no-bid contracts to be awarded to fly-by-night companies that cannot get the job done at the end of the day.

I know how important this restoration work is, particularly to the members from Arizona. So I am not going to ask— not going to vote against the bill today, but I hope that we can put some necessary guardrails into this legislation to ensure that the work actually gets done and taxpayer dollars aren't diverted to this administration's vanity projects. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thanks so much, Senator Heinrich. Any other senator recognized?

Yes, Senator Cortez Masterson. Thank you. First, Mr. Chairman, I want to thank both you and Ranking Member Heinrich for working with me and my colleague, Senator Murkowski, on including the bipartisan energy bills on the agenda today, the, the 4166, which is the Secure Grid Act, and the S4406, the Next Generation Geothermal Research and Development Act. The Secure Grid Act will help states better prepare for risks to their electric grids. It will both bolster annual state energy security plans to combat threats, including supply chain constraints, weather-related threats, physical grid attacks, and growing energy demand.

The Next Generation Geothermal Research and Development Act will establish a robust targeted roadmap to support new geothermal technologies. Nevada is currently the second largest producer of geothermal electricity in the United States. This legislation will help Nevada and the entire United States compete globally and remain at the forefront of geothermal energy innovation and job creation. Advancing these two bills is critical for securing our grid. And so I appreciate the support today.

I want to take a moment, though, Mr. Chairman, and also talk about some lands bills from the state of Nevada. There were three of them that we were hoping to be on the agenda today, as you well know, and your staff. One of them was S1005, the Southern Nevada Economic Development and Conservation Act. S462, the Truckee Meadows Public Lands Management Act. And H.R.

2317, The Northern Nevada Economic Development and Conservation Act. While these bills sponsored by myself, Senator Rosen, and our congressman from Nevada, Congressman Amadei, were ultimately not included on the final list of the bills that were considered today, I want to note we have been working closely with you and your staff, and we hope we will have the chairman and the ranking members. We thank the ranking member as well and his staff for working with us. We hope we have your support to move all 3 of these bills together at our next markup. I just want to note that, again, I appreciate your— your staff have been willing to work with us, including through October, even during the recess, to get these bills in a position to really move them in November.

And I cannot thank you enough. As you well know, since Congressman Amadei's bill passed the House a few weeks ago, we have been working together to utilize the remaining time we have this Congress, since he is leaving Congress, he's retiring from Congress, to move all three of these bills. And as you know, the Southern Nevada Lands Bill that I introduced was passed with bipartisan support out of this committee last Congress. And that's what we're looking to do in Nevada. Smart federal land policy is critical to support conservation, lowering housing costs, create jobs, responsibly plan for future growth.

It's all about these bills. Including Senator Rosen's Washoe bill. All three of them are important for the state of Nevada. So, Mr. Chairman, one, I hope we can continue working on these bills. And can you commit, if not a specific date, November 18th, to a date in November that we can look to put these bills on the agenda?

Yes. Look, I very much want to make that happen. You know, as we've discussed in the past, we've got a lot of commonalities between our states. We've got a lot of federal land, and both states have growing populations with a lot of needs and also a lot of economic challenges just related to the fact that we're sort of bounded by federal land on all sides. I'm very anxious to move this forward.

When we met earlier this year to talk about it, I laid out some clear objectives. I'd love to work with you on this. Um, uh, want to take a hard look at the, the designations, uh, in your bill and also consider extending some of the same treatment that you've got with, uh, Snipilma, uh, to some of the other, um, uh, western states in similar positions. Um, I eagerly work to get your to get a bill ready for markup. We— when we talked a few months ago, we agreed on some broad terms.

There was a breakdown in communication along the way. We started hearing back from your staff again last week, and we're making really good progress. So we'll commit to working through the upcoming recess with you on that. I would very much like to get this marked up this year. I appreciate that.

Thank you. And for the record, I also have a statement from Senator Rosen I would like to submit. It's a similar statement of Without objection. You and Senator Rosen have worked very hard on this, Congressman Amadei also, and with him leaving, this would be a good time to get these things through. Thank you.

Thanks so much. Senator Murkowski. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you and the ranking member for this hearing this morning and for being able to move a good package of bills out. And I want to acknowledge and thank my friend from Nevada, Senator Cortez Masto. We've worked on a lot of good things together and we're continuing that with two of the bills that we've been able to advance.

I am really excited about the next-gen geothermal research and development, and I know the chairman shares enthusiasm about geothermal prospects and how it can play a more important role in our energy conversation. Right now we've got some technologies that would allow us to access heat in places where conventional geothermal hasn't been practical, and the potential resource is enormous. It's really— there's a more technical term, but it's just cool. Or it's hot, I guess.

But I mean, we're talking about more than 5,000 gigawatts of deep enhanced geothermal resource potential in the United States. And both of you, the chairman and the ranking member, know full well about the great potential there. So really excited about that bill. As well as the Secure Grid Act, working on that with you, Senator Cortez Masto, as well as Senator Shaheen. You know, when we're talking about grid security, we need to be looking at the entire system here, not just the bulk power system.

But we got to look to the local distribution infrastructure that actually gets the electricity to the homes, to the military installations, to the businesses. And we all know we're asking more and more of our grid. Demand's growing, and with all the industrial loads coming on, we've just got to be doing more. So to be able to have a better framework for identifying vulnerabilities, I think, is just smart and good common sense. And then the last one that I'm pleased that we have been able to advance today is Earth MRI reauthorization.

Thank you for this one. Been working with Senator Hickenlooper on it. To give us more and better information about hazard monitoring, but also critical minerals, geothermal resources, other subsurface resources, while we attempt to reduce the risk and the cost of exploration. It's a big deal in, in my state when we see the very significant gaps in geologic data. So we're excited about all of these.

Hopefully we've got a path forward for them through the end of the year. And I want to to just end my remarks not on these particular bills, but to acknowledge the good work of the two of you in advancing permitting reform to the place that we are at. I know we're still awaiting text on this, but certainly the framework that is out there is so good. And I know that in any negotiated product, it's not 100% of what anybody wants. But that's not what the legislative process is all about.

It's a series of give and takes. And I think you have worked hard and diligently to make sure that the interests of people around the country in very different places, in very different spaces, that their interests are addressed. So whether you're from very rural Alaska or urban urban New York. These reforms on permitting are going to be so important for the, the economic well-being and just, just the strength of our country. So I know we're just getting started.

I know that there's going to be tons of potshots taken at you for leading on this bill because people are going to say you didn't do enough for me. But just remember that if we can get 80%, 85% Think about where that places us today. So I would just remind all of us, let's focus on the good in this and not be so heavily critical on the things that we wish could have been in there. We put them on the next list for that next round of permitting reform. But my, my thanks and appreciation go out to you as well as Senator Capito and Senator Whitehouse.

Well done.

Thanks so much, Senator Murkowski. I really appreciate it.

I want to have your entire speech, particularly the end part, the pep talk about the permitting bill, embroidered on a pillow or something, or put on a note card. I'll carry it around with me over the next few weeks as we try to move this to the finish line. But thank you. And as I indicated earlier, we stand on the shoulders of giants. You were one of those giants.

Several pieces of your legislation are in there. And of course, when I joined this committee nearly 16 years ago, I came and you were the ranking member at the time. You've been working on this stuff for a long time. You're also right. Geothermal is cool.

I mean, the baseload dispatchable power, zero emissions. What's not to like about that? It's amazing. Technology is improving. I still love the name of your Earth MRI bill, although it always causes me to go down a deep dive wondering what it would look like to put the Earth in an MRI.

How we would hold the Earth still for the exercise, how we would extract the metal, because apparently you can't have metal inside an MRI. It's interesting.

Yes.

It could be a rotating machine.

Ruben's on it. He's going to figure out how to do it.

Anybody else want to be recognized to speak on Anything that's come up today? If not, uh, the committee stands adjourned. Thanks to all of you, uh, for your cooperation and, uh, hard work on these issues. Well done.